Putting a different transmission behind a DT466 - Need some wisdom Spicer 6+1 to ?

Hey guys, as the title says I need some wisdom from some of you that work on this stuff daily. I bought a 98' International 4900 S/A tractor cheap. Has the Spicer 6+1 7 speed that was really common in these trucks. Its a an ES065-7A. Only had L and R functioning. Pulled it yesterday and the pocket bearing on the input shaft is gone as are the splines where the mainshaft splines into the output shaft. Basically all the shafts are toast. I stopped there and didn't get into the forks. I think one of those is damaged too based on debris I found. SO. This isn't my dream transmission. Questioning how many dollars I want to put into it. It was supposedly replaced around 150k miles ago. Has anyone seen this before? the tag is clearly stamped ES065 - I am thinking its a 650 ftlb rated transmission- right on the edge of what my engine should be outputting. Do the HT 466's tear these up or did I just get an anomaly? I kind of want a 13 speed or an 8LL or something more fun/better for off road use. Making the truck into a little dump truck. What kind of pitfalls am I going to have putting one of these in here? I believe I have a Sae #2 bell housing/clutch housing. I have a pull type clutch, but the spicer has no trans brake. 10 spline input shaft. I see some other transmissions out there that look like that would work, would just have to add a rear support and shorten the driveshaft. I am thinking the shift tower may move back too? Basically looking to talk this out with some of you to decide what route to take. There is a 77' frieightliner for sale locally with a 13 in it behind a 350 cummins. I haven't go a hold of the seller yet to see if I can go look at it for the transmission. Its a CEO so i'm sure the sifter wouldn't work but might the tower? I can't find much info on what bell housing a 350 would have. Anyone know? As for the trans brake, if I found a transmission that has one, I assume the pull type clutch should be compatible to operate it or am I looking at having to change out clutch and throw out bearing too?

I would think a 13 or 8ll is way overkill for no more truck than you have. Its length weight and complexity, none of which you need. I'd look for a newer 9 or 10speed or even a super 10, and figure out if you need a forward or center tower location. Figure out if you need a big input shaft or the small one (I'm guessing small), and whether your current transmission is a direct drive, underdrive, or overdrive in the top gear and what the low gear ratio is. Any 9 or 10 is going to have closer ratio's than the 7 speed, and you're not likely to hurt one with a 466. They are also not near as difficult to find or as expensive as a 13 or 8ll, the big dump truck guys are all snatching them up. There's no reason to buy a whole truck just to get the transmission, they aren't that rare, I'd look for a newer junkyard trans, before buying a '77.

Its more about want than need I bought this as sort of a for fun project. If the 7 had been an easy fix I would have just put it back in, but now it seems like maybe looking for something else isn't the most foolish idea. I am pretty sure the current trans is an overdrive. What I can't find is the rear axle ratio. I never got to run down the road in this but seeing how it was set up, as a road tractor, I am thinking its probably geared on the higher end. Not opposed to a 9 or 10 if one pops up. Never driven a super 10.... have heard mixed things. Is forward or center tower coded into the model number of Eaton transmissions like the other specs are? The 77' is a junker. Doesn't run. Sitting in waist high weeds. Cabs all bent like someone moved it with an excavator or something. I was more thinking if I could get it for a few hundred bucks and the transmission was compatible I would rather put the money into going through that one than rebuilding my 7 speed.

Give me the last eight of your VIN and I should be able to look up the gear ratio.

last 8 of the VIN are WH520582 - If you can see what HP engine it has can you let me know that too? Seller said it was the 250 HP HT variant. Haven't interdependently confirmed that but he seemed honest about it. He bought the truck new actually.

You can just jack up the rear end and spin a tire while someone counts revolutions of the driveline, to find out your rear axle ratio.

crane operator said: You can just jack up the rear end and spin a tire while someone counts revolutions of the driveline, to find out your rear axle ratio. Click to expand... divided by two or tie a string to the balance weight or U joint and then count the wraps.

Andy1845c said: Is forward or center tower coded into the model number of Eaton transmissions like the other specs are? Click to expand... Sometimes.

Delmer said: divided by two Click to expand... I always just make two revolutions of the tire. I think.

X 2, I was trying to make a joke, and still got the math wrong!

Short response from someone who maintained a IH fleet. The Spicer was OK, but they did fail occasionally just like you described. Not overly expensive or difficult to replace with a reman. The super 10 suggestion is intriguing. For me, I like to 8LL all the things.

I had two of those transmissions in International "S" series trucks and neither were liked as they were worn out far too early. I installed an RT-9509 w/#2 bell into one truck and it was a good match. I want to say the axle ratio was lower than 3:55 but the non overdriven trans was great in the application. No splitter "whine" as was common with the older 13 speeds either. Ran that truck several years till closing up shop. The other truck was a 1999 w/240hp DT-466E engine and didn't keep that truck two years. Almost a year of that was back at the dealer time and time again for major repairs; turbo, head, dropped valve, transmission, emissions.....

This thread is worthless without pictures. TT-215 is a helluva rig. She’s still plying the muddy roads of SW Alaska delivering the liquid gold.

Here’s my truck. I have zero need for it. Wanted it because I’ve always kinda wanted to put a single axle dump together and these 4900s are what I cut my teeth on when I was a kid. Going to pull the cab and putz around fixing the rust. hoping I have better luck with my 466 than you, 1693TA… I drove so many of them back in the day and never had much for issues.

This is the engine : International : DT 466E HEUI INT DSL 250HP/2300RPM 50 State 250 HP @ 2300 RPM, 660 lb-ft Torque @ 1450 RPM, 2300 RPM Governed Speed Transmission: TRANSMISSION, MANUAL {International 6-PLUS (ESO65-7A)} 7-Speed Manual; with Overdrive Rear axle: DIFFERENTIAL, REAR 5.63:1 c AXLE, REAR, SINGLE {Spicer J210-S} Single Reduction 21,000-lb Capacity, With 190 Wheel Ends 5.63:1 is the rear axle ratio according to the parts manual. The truck looks to be in good condition for 25 years old. Northern Insulation Products was the original owner.

crane operator said: I always just make two revolutions of the tire. I think. Click to expand... 10 is better. Use two people. mark the tire and the shaft.

With a 5.63 axle ratio you will be gear bound without a overdrive of .74. Your best bet is a 10 speed C model, it has a low of either 11.6 or 12.69 with a overdrive of .74.

I just can't believe a dt466 could hurt a transmission of any kinda

The transmissions they use in these trucks wear the syncros out over time, they also are prone to slow oil leaks in a couple spots. Ten years without checking the oil level is not unusual. We had one towed to the shop a couple months back, the driver broke the shift lever off just below the pivot ball in the tower. One inch diameter hard steel shaft and he somehow broke it.

Well I started asking around ended up with another whole parts truck with a mechanical 466 and a RTO 9513 in it with a mated hydraulic pump. I’ll have to change my axle gearing but seems worth it given the circumstances.